However, please keep in mind that a) I seem to tend to write novelish responses to begin with
I haven’t written one in quite a while so I’ve got a lot of shit on my mind and c) something’s actually bothering me enough to make a new topic, and god knows how I hate making topics (seriously, I hate new topics, and they terrify me, but I’m doing it anyway). Hopefully you’ll stick with me at least a little while before you bitch and moan that I’m rambling, but you might not. In which case, skip the rest of this post, and please commence your bitching now. 
I’m not entirely sure where to start, because there have been a number of things floating around in my head lately. Admittedly, many of them are probably of the ‘beating the dead horse’ variety, but tough shit. At least I’m not making an entirely useless thread. Or maybe I am, and if that’s the case, please feel free to tell me so, just try to make it at least somewhat witty and/or sarcastic.
I’ve been kind of AWOL from the boards for a while (I’m sure most of you didn’t notice, but that’s not really the point) but now that I have high speed internet (a big fucking WOOHOO
) hopefully I’ll be around a bit more. I suppose the hopefully is for me, because if you don’t like me, it’s really not a good thing that I’ll be around more….but in that case, I really don’t give a shit. From what I’ve heard from a lot of people, and what I’ve seen lately, there has been a ton of (and I’m generalizing here, don’t shoot me) the usual old vs new, S/T vs ABL, band going mainstream etc etc etc blather, plus a ton of CRAP. I’ve commented on a couple of the issues before, but considering the rampant debates (if you could even call them that) I’ll throw my two or three Canadian cents in again, along with some other stuff that’s been rattling around in my brain lately.
Oh, and a short one on that topic- people either want conversations that are somewhat intellectual but then say it’s beating a dead horse, or they want conversations filled with nothing and complain when there’s nothing interesting said. What the hell?
Anyhow, newness, since there’s so many new people… it’s been talked about ad nauseum, but I know this from first hand experience. No one cares if you’re new. Absolutely no one. There is only one caveat. Don’t act like a fucking tool. Some of you new people may not believe me, but I swear to god it’s true. I feel sometimes like I’m beating my head against my keyboard when I’m saying this, because undoubtedly I’ll get an ‘I’m new, and people were mean to me’ comment. You know what? Most of the shitty people are new. I realize this, and I’m new too (I don’t care what you say, 10 months still feels new to me).
Now, if you’re one of those people thinking “Hey! Most of the shitty people aren’t new!! That’s an unfair generalization!!!” then you’re probably one of those people. If you’re that daft that you don’t realize the craptacularness that is the majority of new people, YOU ARE ONE. Don’t be a moron, people won’t yell at you, and you’ll be fine. Seriously. No one of any consequence has ever yelled at me, and a lot of my best friends on these boards are people that aren’t new. And you know what? If they do yell at you and you can’t deal with it, just leave. Because if you do stick around after being yelled at, and stop doing things that people will yell at you for, you’ll find that you fit in quite nicely. If you’re smart enough to learn from your previous idiocy, or if you have any sense of humour whatsoever, people will like, or at least tolerate you.
Okay, moving on (sort of).
Ahhhhhhhhhh the mainstream-ness of the band, S/T vs ABL, etc. Since I already wrote something somewhere about my feelings on the CD debate (hey look, you can find it HERE if you actually care to read it, although it’s really not that exciting and I probably wouldn’t bother) I’ll try to at least say something new. Or…new-ish. [Note: prepare for round two of beating a dead horse]
Their sound has changed, yadda yadda. That much is obvious. But to me, being that we’re all still here because something keeps us here….our job is to promote the band the best we can. To get them the recognition that they deserve AS A BAND (and not just for one particular song or CD). Now, that being said, and I think Tomo mentioned this in an interview but I’ll be damned if I can find it, we want to bring in the right kind of people. Oh sure, you’re going to get the idiots en masse, and that’s to be expected. As selfish as I (and many of you, I would imagine) want to be sometimes and keep the band relatively small and all to ourselves, it isn’t really about us. And here’s where I might differ on the ‘I hope they get really fucking huge’ idea. Or possibly not, I’d like to know.
You see, I’m not a music kinda girl. Oh sure, I like music, don’t get me wrong. But I’m not a ‘comb-through-the-record-stores-and-research-bands’ person. I’m a ‘listen-to-the-radio-and-hope-something-catches-my-fancy’ kinda girl. So for me to join those of you in the ‘I hate that they’re all over MTV and the radio’ contingent would make me a complete fucking hypocrite.
Because that’s how I found this band in the first place.
I heard/saw Attack on Yahoo Launch player quite randomly while I was studying for my exam one night. Mainstream? I think so. Now, that isn’t what kept me here. In addition to the music, the insanity and the art and the mythology and the mystery kept me here. YOU people kept me here. I’ve never loved a band in my life. EVER. Not until now. Not until this goddamn band sucked me in. People who know me are still confused. “You?? You love a band???” “But…it’s not just a band” I try to explain to them.
And this is precisely what I think about when I hear people say that they don’t want them everywhere. I hate that people assume that marketing and big time labels means selling out. Don’t get me wrong, sometimes it can, I’m fully aware of that. But to say it’s automatic is fucking ridiculous.
Can you remember the first record you listened to that got you into music? What was the gateway group/CD that made you a music fan? Chances are you didn’t just come across obscure bands by accident. Changes are you listened to something huge, something mainstream that made you check out other bands- that made you interested in what music could offer.
Making it into the mainstream doesn’t equal selling out by default. Not at all, and it infuriates me to see so many comments that make that connection. Don’t you want the record label to be behind the band? Heaven forbid they actually use marketing tactics, my god. THE NERVE.
A lot of people are talking about how the band has changed in the way that it markets itself, specifically Jared. Now, this much is fairly obvious, because we know that there are no more cancelled shows because they mentioned his name, etc. etc. And I’ve been contemplating this whole ‘selling out’ bit, so here’s my partial theory.
Firstly, just doing a comparison of the two CD’s (oh god, I know, here we go again)... From what I’ve read, for many listeners- old timers especially- ABL doesn’t seem as risky as the band makes it out to be, considering it comes way closer to other popular band’s music than does the S/T. However, I want to stop for a second and actually process some of the things that Jared has said (yeah, I’m using Jared only here, but he talks the most, so just deal with it). Looking at the ‘head vs heart’comment (and if you don’t know what I’m referring to here, you might as well just leave the thread now)…the more I actually think about it, the more it makes sense that it was risky.
Here’s someone who writes opaque, ambiguous, beautiful songs that make your fucking head spin. There’s nothing in those S/T songs that’s transparent. And that’s not to say they’re not emotional, because they are, but they aren’t exactly easy to read into. So for him, being who he is, having people know (to a certain degree) what happened during that period of his life, I think it would have been kind of terrifying for him to be writing the openly emotional songs that he was. As well, let’s not forget (or at least it’s my assumption) that when you’re a musician, you can’t help but write about what’s spinning around in your head. So who can blame him for writing the album the way it was written?
He decided to (presumably, obviously I actually have no idea since I don’t know him) let his infamous guard down a little bit and write an album that was more easily accessible, and although it might not seem to be that big a deal to us, I think that the band at least has to be commended for embracing a different sound and being unafraid to try something different for them. They always said they want to be continuously changing, and I hope they continue that trend, wherever the hell it leads them. Don’t make the same CD twice, no matter how good it is. Keep us guessing, keep us wanting more.
Secondly, in terms of the marketing, etc. I obviously wasn’t around for the S/T days, so I’m basing these judgments on stories I’ve been told and things that I’ve read. I’ve always admired Jared’s refusal to use his acting fame to push the band. He’s tried as much as possible to keep his two careers separate, and how can you not love that? People have been complaining lately about the changes they’ve seen, and it’s been bugging me that I can’t quite put my finger on why I don’t exactly feel the same way. I mean, yes, it bugs me when the band goes to do an interview and he talks about his movies. I HATE the fact that some radio DJ’s still call it ‘actor Jared Leto’s band’ It pisses me off too, so please don’t think that I don’t get the aggravation. Because I do.
But the closer I look, the more it seems like lately he’s just acting like the lead singer of a band, which is what he is. When the S/T first came out, I would imagine that the reason he was so against his name being used to market the band was because he wanted to prove to everyone (and himself) that the band was fucking good enough on its own. And they are.
And now they’re getting recognition as a band. Not so much as ‘actor Jared Leto’s side project.’ They’re getting recognition as a BAND, who he happens to be the lead singer/songwriter for. Goodness knows the crazy man has a little bit (okay, a lot sometimes) of lead-singer-syndrome. And I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. I mean, why shouldn’t he be promoting the hell out of his band? Yeah, it irks me when it’s done in the actor vein, but most of the time it’s just him…being a lead singer…and leading the fucking band. Maybe he’s finally comfortable with the fact that people are paying attention to him as a singer, and not ‘that guy they saw in that movie who happens to be in a band.’ No, things aren’t always going to be the same as they were during the S/T days, but it doesn’t automatically mean that everything has gone down the crapper.
They give us so much, and yet we’re still so greedy. They give us a signing line, we say they’re impersonal. They come out afterwards to chat, and we say they were in a bad mood or didn’t stay long enough. How horrible if one of them actually doesn’t come out and talk to us afterwards because they’re exhausted or have other things to do. They put us on their posters, they involve us in projects. For the love of god, people, they PLAYED A SONG AT A CONCERT BECAUSE WE WANTED THEM TO. It isn’t that the mystery is gone, it’s that we’re becoming jaded. They give us a ton, and still, we ask for more, more, more. They don’t owe us a fucking thing, other than a good concert. That’s it. Everything else is just a bonus, just something we get because they’re fucking awesome.
When I read the letter that Jared wrote to us about the VMA’s, I honestly could not stop smiling. I kid you not. Of course we all know that the VMA’s are a big crapshoot and most people are really blasé about the whole thing, and it doesn’t actually mean anything, but isn’t it refreshing for a change to hear someone say ‘you know what, I want to fucking win this thing.’ Now, for me, it was the reasoning behind wanting to win it that struck me as beautiful, and the way that letter was written reminded me why I love this fucking band.
It isn’t that he wants to win it to get on TV, or to make the band more money. It isn’t that the band wants to win it to sell x amount of CD’s. He wants to win it because people said he wasn’t good enough, that the band could never do it. He wants to win it because then people will be forced to pay attention to what the band has to say. He wants to win it because no one thinks they have a chance. And like he said, who doesn’t love a good fight? How can you not admire someone who thinks like that?
The fact is, what is ‘mainstream’ is continually changing. Isn’t that the point? I want to help this band become what people said they couldn’t be. I want this band to be the kind of band that people think of when they think of the group that made them love music. I want this band to do to other people what they did to me.
I have no problems with old timers loving the hell out of the S/T, or thinking that the new people are shit. I even understand why. But please realize that for a lot of people, ABL is the way of getting into the unique and bizarre world of this band. It’s a way of getting people to appreciate not only the S/T CD, but the entire culture of 30 Seconds to Mars.
And yeah, the band getting huge is going to bring in a lot of shitty people, I don’t doubt that for a second. But within those masses of shitty people are undoubtedly some people that will get it, and those are the people that are important. It’s those people that will help to carry on the traditions and rituals that YOU all helped start. There are a lot of us here that weren’t here for the S/T days, but sometimes we feel like we were. We feel that way because of you, because you’re still here, and because you pass down to us the culture of what it means to call yourself echelon. What the hell would we do if you weren’t here?
Really, though- think about what that actually means. It’s not just about being a fan of the band. It’s not just about putting up a few posters. The title actually means something more than just that. It’s something I’ve tried numerous times to describe to people, and I haven’t yet put my finger on it (and my god, this post would really go on forever if I attempted it, just ask Proxen or Minara). I just know that it’s something that I wanted to earn before I allowed myself to be called by it; something that I felt I had to earn. I know that it’s something inside that I can’t quite place, and although I often wonder whether I’m worthy of the title, something makes me know that I can proudly call myself echelon, though I have yet to peg down what that something actually is.
I’ve read that a lot of you are still out there lurking, wondering if you want to bother to combat the rampant idiocy and shitty threads. I came back the other night on the boards for the first time in a while, and I was so excited to finally be back….except I found myself feeling lost and confused. Where are all of the people that I know? Why do I feel like anything I post would be completely irrelevant?
WHY DO I FEEL LIKE BITCHING AT PEOPLE???
WHERE ARE THE WITTY AND WEIRD COMMENTS???!?!?!??!
FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THAT IS HOLY, WHERE IS THE SARCASM???!?!?!
And so I sat there, quietly freaking out that this insane messageboard that I had grown to love had outgrown me. But then I thought of all of the people that stuck around through many, many waves of this nonsense. And it scares me to think that maybe this is the time that people might not stick around. There might not be enough people who get it to uphold the traditions and values and neurotic weirdness that makes this board what it is. At least when there was a bad thread, you could count on something interesting and ridiculous to come out of it. Now it seems like people are giving up to some extent, and that freaks me the fuck out. Oh sure, this is all melodramatic and probably ridiculous since I’m sure these waves come all of the time and people disappear, but honestly….it scares me.
And so I say to you, to those who get it:
For fuck’s sakes, don’t give up now. If it means something to you, do something about it. We’re here because we love this band. We’re here because there’s something dragging us in, no matter how we ended up here or when we got hauled into this insanity. We’re here because the simple term [echelon] means something. Because a red wristband with four white glyphs isn’t just a pretty bracelet you wear to a show.
Don’t leave because you can’t take it anymore.
Stay because this is when we need you the most.
) people i have ever had the pleasure of talking to. I signed up for this on my first day of freedom and havent looked back since. i just look forward to what everyone on here has to say and being changed forever by the band that saved my life in a way (sorry for going on so long but i just felt oddly motivated thanks to lily 
